Behind the Scenes of Venom: The Last Dance: An Interview with Digital Domain’s Scott Edelstein and Ellen Hoffmann

With over two decades in the visual effects industry, Scott Edelstein has contributed to more than 50 feature films and over 160 commercial projects, including Spider-Man: No Way Home, Avengers: Endgame, and Avengers: Infinity War.

Serving as an Animation Supervisor at Digital Domain, Ellen Hoffmann brings nearly 20 years of experience, having worked on projects such as Beauty and the Beast, X-Men: Days of Future Past, and Black Widow.

Digital Domain played a pivotal role in bringing the dark and dynamic world of Venom: The Last Dance to life. From the eerie landscapes of Klyntar to the intricate performances of Knull and the terrifying Xenophages, the studio’s efforts were critical to the film's success. We spoke with Scott Edelstein, VFX Supervisor, and Ellen Hoffmann, Animation Supervisor, about the creative and technical challenges behind these remarkable achievements.

Interview with Scott Edelstein (VFX Supervisor)

1. Could you elaborate on the creative and technical challenges of designing the environment of Klyntar, and what tools or techniques were pivotal in achieving the "living tar"     effect?

Scott Edelstein: For the design of Klyntar, we faced the challenge of not just creating an environment, but one that felt alive — constantly shifting and evolving in a way that reflected how it was created by the symbiotes. The environment had to seem as though it was a character in its own right, responding with an organic, unpredictable nature.

The most pivotal tool for this was Houdini, which allowed us to simulate the fluid, living quality of Klyntar’s surface. We used a variety of techniques to create the "living tar" effect — fluid simulations helped us achieve a sense of movement, with the environment constantly shifting and breathing. The organic texture changes across the environment added to the feeling of instability, with the surface seemingly responding to internal forces or external influences.

Lighting also played a crucial role. We used Houdini’s capabilities to craft subtle yet dynamic lighting that added to the eerie, oppressive atmosphere of Klyntar. The lighting helped enhance the organic qualities of the environment, casting shadows that made the surfaces feel more alive, while maintaining a sense of mystery and danger.

Once we had the simulation and lighting set, we turned to Nuke for compositing. This allowed us to fine-tune the integration of the environment into the scenes, adding atmosphere, subtle color variations, and refining details to ensure everything fit cohesively within the overall visual narrative. The goal was to make Klyntar not just a visual element, but a fully immersive world that felt alive and ever-changing.

2. What was the most complex or memorable sequence you worked on, and how did your team overcome the challenges it presented?

SE: The most complex and memorable sequence we worked on was undoubtedly the single shot depicting the creation of the Codex. It was an ambitious, all-CG shot that not only spanned a long duration but also took place at a micro-scale, showing the intricate merging of human and symbiote energies. The shot culminated with the Codex becoming one with the Necrosword, and we were tasked with bringing this transformation to life in a visually compelling way.

The editorial team provided us with a rough concept as a starting point, leaving a lot of room for interpretation, which meant that the creative and technical aspects of the shot had to be developed from the ground up. Given the tight timeline, we had to quickly establish a unified vision for how the transformation would unfold, from the swirling energy patterns to the fine details of the Codex's formation.

To tackle this, we relied heavily on Houdini for both the animation and FX. The energy merging between the human and symbiote forces required delicate fluid simulations, and we had to ensure that the movement was both dynamic and believable at such a microscopic level. The interplay of light, texture, and energy was crucial in making the shot feel tangible and meaningful. Simultaneously, we had to keep in mind how the Codex would eventually merge with the Necrosword, so we had to think ahead and design that final moment in a way that seamlessly integrated with the rest of the sequence.

Given the enormity of the task, constant collaboration between animation, VFX, and compositing teams was essential. We maintained an iterative process, reviewing progress frequently to adjust elements and refine details. Nuke was invaluable during compositing, allowing us to fine-tune the interactions of light, texture, and color, ensuring that the final shot had the right balance of mysticism and intensity.

This sequence pushed our creative and technical limits, but the team’s ability to break it down into manageable milestones and maintain clear communication across departments ultimately allowed us to achieve a visually stunning and narratively powerful shot within the limited time frame.

3. How did the tight timeline of three months shape your approach to planning and executing the VFX?

SE: The three-month timeline for this project was undeniably tight, but it also forced us to adopt a highly efficient, focused workflow that helped keep us on track without compromising the quality of our VFX. From the outset, we knew that careful planning would be essential, so we dedicated significant time in animation and FX making sure we would be ready for anything. This gave us the ability to adapt quickly while avoiding unnecessary iterations. Having a strong visual foundation in place early was also critical for setting the tone of Klyntar and ensuring a unified direction as we moved forward.

Collaboration was key throughout the entire process. With such a short window, we needed to stay in constant communication with all departments, particularly animation and lighting. This ensured that the VFX team’s work remained consistent with the overall vision, and that any feedback was incorporated as quickly as possible. Regular check-ins with the director, client VFX teams, and other vendors allowed us to keep everyone aligned and adjust where necessary to maintain both quality and efficiency.

In terms of execution, we broke the process into clear phases: starting with the foundational simulations and layout work in Houdini, then moving to the animation and rendering stages, and finishing with compositing and final tweaks in Nuke. This phased approach ensured that we could get quick feedback on early iterations, make necessary refinements, and stay on schedule. By staying agile and focused on incremental goals, we were able to deliver work that hit the emotional and visual notes required without sacrificing quality, even under a tight timeline.

Interview with Ellen Hoffmann (Animation Supervisor)

1. Can you share more about the proprietary tools like Masquerade3 and how they enhanced Knull’s emotional performance?‍‍

Ellen Hoffmann: By utilizing our high-quality marker less facial capture, Masquerade3, we trained our Knull face model directly using Tom Hardy's performance data. Throughout the process, we made sure to integrate Knull-specific facial shapes to capture the character's unique features. After training, we processed each shot, extracting detailed facial data that could be fine-tuned and enhanced as needed, ensuring the final result was both polished and true to the character.

2. The Xenophages are visually terrifying. What was your approach to animating them in a way that balanced realism with their monstrous nature?

EH: The Xenophages were developed by other vendors, but within a short time frame, we were able to effectively communicate and gather a wide range of references to study and adapt their movements. We also drew inspiration from the erratic, unpredictable behaviour of fighting hyenas, capturing their rapid, sharp motions while still conveying the heft and weightiness appropriate for creatures of their size. Although all Xenophages share a common goal, it's important to note that there is an ongoing struggle for dominance among them, with rank-order fights influencing their interactions.

3. Looking back, are there any aspects of the animation process that stood out to you as particularly innovative or challenging?

EH: We were working with a scene that featured a large group of Xenosphages in a single shot, which could have been difficult to handle. However, with careful planning and the help of our in-house crowd animation tools, we were able to make the scene with a lot of creatures both manageable and workable.

4. What were some of the unique challenges in capturing Knull's subtle facial expressions, especially in scenes with minimal lighting?

EH: With Masquerade, we had a strong foundation, thanks to the subtle facial motions already in place. From there, we were able to enhance certain movements, particularly around the forehead. We also added small, yet impactful details—like shifts in the hairline, the movement of the temporalis muscles, and occasional jaw clenching—to bring more depth and realism to his performance.

5. Were there any moments in the film where animation played a critical role in driving the narrative?

EH: Knull sits, trapped in his throne, weak and straining against his restraints. Every subtle movement—slight shifts of his body, the rise and fall of his breath, faint hand twitches, and occasional trembling—was essential to convey his struggle and keep him feeling alive, amplifying the intensity of the moment. We also incorporated small details like the shifting of his hairline, the flex of his temporalis muscles, and the occasional clenching of his jaw to add depth and realism to his performance.

It’s fascinating to see the dedication and teamwork that go into creating such intricate and memorable visual effects. The insights shared by Scott Edelstein and Ellen Hoffmann highlight the blend of creativity, technical expertise, and collaboration required to bring complex scenes to life.

We look forward to seeing more groundbreaking work from the talented team at Digital Domain.

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